Water expands 6x more than air when compressed but without the added heat. When a water mist is added to the incoming air charge, it adds power because once the piston comes up on compression, the water mist filled air tries harder to expand so on the exhaust stroke, it pushes the piston down with more force...all the while keeping detonation in check by maintaining a cool combustion chamber temp. Unless you have tried to build and tune a vehicle to run really lean by utilizing a large amount (8-10 liters per minute of hydroxy gas) it's hard to grasp the concept of what hydrogen is capable of. I understand what is needed, so modifying my TPI motor is the most important aspect of where I am at with it. There is actually a lot of little things to think about but the two most important things imo to think about is that 1.)Hydrogen is 8x more combustable than petrol gasoline and 2.)Flammability rate is far broader than petrol gasoline. Now, knowing that anything organic (ie naturally occuring compounds or elements) once converted to near plasma state will combust and thus be used as a fuel (this is fact, not wishful thinking), then one can begin to see how hydroxy can play a part in fuel mileage and performance. I have less time to talk about it vs. building it and experimenting with it. I'm building my water fuel cell right now but the cost of 316 type stainless sheets ain't cheap. What I am most interested in is how to modify the various computer sensor inputs so I can lean the fuel out...actually producing the gas isn't hard...the hard part is making your computer learn the new system. I agree that most people are skeptical about it to the point of being convinced it can't work but the weird thing is the same people who say it can't be done haven't ever tried themselves...and thats because this is all based on real chemistry/electrical data. Nobody can believe it until they see it so that is what I am set out to do....I'm clearly not the first one to do it but since I don't personally know anyone who has, my only option is to build it and see what I end up with. It's weird where these things can take you...I spent an hour on the phone with a guy in Ohio just talking about why a pulsing AC waveform is more efficient than a DC direct current waveform with regards to excessive amp draw boiling water away instead of creating usable gas....weird stuff...and stuff I never knew about.
water for power?
- Thread starter gbodystuff
- Start date
if ya dissappear, we'll all know, you're on your own private Island, driving your water cars around. :lol:
But I really am hopeful that this will work. Once I get the motor running, I may make this my next project.
But I really am hopeful that this will work. Once I get the motor running, I may make this my next project.
I have diagrams for the cell and related components for it like an AC power inverter, PWM control unit, bubblers, etc. What I intend to put all this in is my 74 Chevy 4x4 to start with. It is set up for dual tanks which will work for what I intend to do. One tank will be my actual fuel tank while the other will be a stainless 20-gallon tank that will hold tap water. I do still need to figure out how to reliably add an electrolyte to the water as it fills the water cell. Potassium Hydroxide (KOH) is the most common form but after reading about Stanley Meyers work, he achieved a water cell that had dangerously high AC voltages with no amperage draw and yet it STILL produced a ton of Hydroxy gas....that is the optimum scenario-build a cell which requires no input to achieve tremendous output. To imagine a device that contradicts all known aspect of electrical theory is hard to wrap ones head around. Then again, the basis for creating such a device has never before been seriously tested at least, not that anybody will admit to or can confirm. I do know the military has a new HumVee that runs on water assist though....makes one wonder.
Well, the only thing an ECM does is regulate various outputs based on various inputs through sensors back and forth. It matters not what kind of computer system it is, they all work in that manner. If you know how they work, you can figure out how to modify them. Or, it may be simpler to use a stand alone (FAST, Megasquirt, etc.) and customize the table parameters yourself. For example, if you know how much hydroxy gas you are creating based on the watts of current through the water cell, you can then regulate gas production via a PWM which can receive a signal from say, the TPS sensor. The TPS sensor sends a variable voltage signal to the ECM which tells it how much fuel (there are other factors, but I am keeping it simple for clarification here...) to add/subtract so you can program the PWM in increase/decrease gas production based on % values in relation to throttle position. Along with this you can add +/- % tables for advancing timing as gas production goes up, shortening the opening period for the injectors when they pulse-even delaying the pulse. Knock sensor tables can aid in keeping the timing where it needs to be also. The O2 sensor tables can even be programmed so that it will look for a lean mixture and further regulate fuel as hydroxy gas production goes up.
The thing to keep in mind is that as cars are designed right now, the ECM tries to maintain a stoichmetric ratio as it pertains to atomized combustion of regular gasoline and air. A stoichmetric rating of 14.7:1 is only an accepted value based on current fuel formulas and combustion chamber designs. If you change this process with the addition of hydroxy in sufficient quantities, by the nature of it you need to lean the fuel out to get the most out of this gaseous mixture. This is where you arrive at 30 or 40:1 AF ratios....you just don't need as much fuel (gasoline) to do the same amount of work-period. So whereas factory computers are designed to enrich the fuel system when you step on the throttle, a stand alone system designed for use with hydroxy must be able to do the opposite-it needs to lean out the gasoline as you throttle up-assuming gas production goes up in a calculated percentage. So water cell feedback info is very important...cell pressure, temperature, PH level, curent draw, etc. can act as variable inputs for a stand alone ECM. Also, contamination is always an area of concern so the use of distilled water or rain water (the sun ionizes it as it passes through the clouds so it de-contaminates it naturally) is a must, as well as a monitoring system for the electrolyte used in the water cell. I'm working with an electrical engineer who is a friend of mine that is building the PWM controller and high voltage driver system for my cell. I have a guy in Ohio sending me actual 316 SS plates for use in my cell which alleviates my cost of having the plates laser cut. I'm really excited about this whole thing. I want to see massive gas production first then I need to iron out the details of the VIC circuit....I can see why most people don't understand or believe this stuff though-you have to have a pretty good grasp on electrical theory, chemistry and engine combustion theory as it relates to flamefrotn speed, timing, etc. if you intend to build a system.
The thing to keep in mind is that as cars are designed right now, the ECM tries to maintain a stoichmetric ratio as it pertains to atomized combustion of regular gasoline and air. A stoichmetric rating of 14.7:1 is only an accepted value based on current fuel formulas and combustion chamber designs. If you change this process with the addition of hydroxy in sufficient quantities, by the nature of it you need to lean the fuel out to get the most out of this gaseous mixture. This is where you arrive at 30 or 40:1 AF ratios....you just don't need as much fuel (gasoline) to do the same amount of work-period. So whereas factory computers are designed to enrich the fuel system when you step on the throttle, a stand alone system designed for use with hydroxy must be able to do the opposite-it needs to lean out the gasoline as you throttle up-assuming gas production goes up in a calculated percentage. So water cell feedback info is very important...cell pressure, temperature, PH level, curent draw, etc. can act as variable inputs for a stand alone ECM. Also, contamination is always an area of concern so the use of distilled water or rain water (the sun ionizes it as it passes through the clouds so it de-contaminates it naturally) is a must, as well as a monitoring system for the electrolyte used in the water cell. I'm working with an electrical engineer who is a friend of mine that is building the PWM controller and high voltage driver system for my cell. I have a guy in Ohio sending me actual 316 SS plates for use in my cell which alleviates my cost of having the plates laser cut. I'm really excited about this whole thing. I want to see massive gas production first then I need to iron out the details of the VIC circuit....I can see why most people don't understand or believe this stuff though-you have to have a pretty good grasp on electrical theory, chemistry and engine combustion theory as it relates to flamefrotn speed, timing, etc. if you intend to build a system.
Doober said:
I'm not too suprised. Well, at least I won't have to write a 2 page oration about how his theories are all but impossible to implement, & most, if not all of them can be disproved with a little common sense applied to basic physics & thermodynamics. I already posted some very basic math to the other Hydroxy gas guy stating why his theories couldn't work, & what a suprise, he disappeared, too.
Best statment of this post so far: "water expands 6x as much as air when compressed" :roll:
Tommy
Similar threads
